[xcevans]

Have a question on the progression in ME weighted carries between weight and duration. I’m long time 68 year old xc ski racer, bc skier will be 30 yrs this season. Was lucky enough to start training with 2 Norwegians in northern Utah 30 yrs ago. Scott will know them John Aalberg, Torbjorn Karlson. Learned basic endurance  training principles from them. Started with uphill athlete when it was published 5-6 years ago. Great book goes into the underlying phsyiology of training. If I know the why it makes it easier to manage training. Had not heard of aet before it has made a big difference in my training. Had always wondered what base was and how much was enough (never to much). I’m self coached using training plan base on uphill athlete and experience. Have had 2 surgeries in last 4 years foot and back. Foot 4 years ago. Back lumbar fusion decompression 2 years ago May. Have been able to maintain a decent base Aet within 10% of Ant due to the long history of training also my Ant has fallen because of not being able to do high intensity work. Amazing how much strain lower back takes when you ramp up the intesity. Part of the recovery is core training which I had not done enough in the past. The back fusion limits me to carring 50 lbs. The nerve compression in my back caused significant leg weakness. One of interesting things in back recovery is process of nerves healing and strength improving. As the nerves heal they form new muscle memory and you can feel it. Fortunately I have been able to start regular training in June with 8 week general strength in gym ending end of July while continuing ongoing base training. General strength has improved a lot especially leg strength. I was able to pass seated leg strength test and have gone to one ME and one z3 workout per week along with base training.

My event goals for this season are 50k Rendezvous xc ski race in early March and ski Mt Shasta in a day in early May (may be to much never no unless you try). Skied Shasta in a day in May 2019.

I have a good ME hill close to home. Steps up 2500 ft over 3 miles. the 1st pitch about a mile with 1000 ft vertical with low 20 degree (40%) pitches with short 10 second false flats. It takes me about 24 minutes. I weight 150 lbs I started with 5% body weight and added 5% per workout to 20% 30lbs in the fourth work today. The ME workouts have gone well feeling the burn hr in z1/z2 have taken about same time with the same hr and same perceived exertion with the weight progression duration about 24 min. The 4th today with 20% 30lb took 4 min longer with same hr but perceived exertion was significantly higher. I haven’t carried that much weight for 6-7 years.

1st question- I plan on doing next ME the same duration should I do it at the same weight or drop back one weight.

2nd question- I plan on extending the duration of ME workouts. 25% bw about 40lb would be the max weight I would work upto depending on how my back responds. My thought is to work upto the 25% 40lb weight at 24 min if my back handles it if it doesn’t I’ll go back down to what weight it can handle. Once I max out weight I can handle at 24 min I plan on extending the duration. What would the pregression you recommend to adding duration. Staying with the same weight or dopping down in weight. What duration would you recomend to workup to. Shasta is 7200 vertical. I would be carring low 20lbs when booting with skis on back. I summited Denali in 2002 and trained with 60lb packs for 3-5000 ft for it. I know I can’t or want to come any where close to that.

Thanks

Steve Evans

[Scott Johnston]

Steve:

Nice to hear from a fellow XC skier.  Yes I knew John Albert pretty well.  He really understood training using the Norwegian method. I remember several long training discussions we had over a beer or two in West Yellowstone.  Both of us being engineers could relate well.  I was very sad to hear of his passing.  He had a big influence in Sun Vally.  TBK, what a character he was.  My wife and were probably his first US friends when the USST hired him to coach the women’s team which in the mid 80s was based in Boulder, CO where we lived at the time. I trained a lot of hours with Torbjorn.

Anyway…On to your questions.  Here is how I would make the most of the ME training to improve your XC skiing endurance. What you are doing now sounds perfect. Nice gradual progression in weight.  I’m a little hazy on the duration end of things though. Is your hill 24 minutes long?  You might consider doing 2 laps if so. Dump the water at the top and refill when you get to the bottom.

But as the fall progresses I would recommend shifting to a more XC ski specific ME workout.  What you are doing has got you moving at too slow of a cadence. It is building good strength and ME fair very steep hills but we don’t have 40% grades in XC skiing. Especially on the Rendezvous course.  I would find a 15-20% grade hill and using moose-hoof technique and no more that 10% of your body weight do weighted uphill intervals at a Z3sort of intensity feeling.  Keep the reps long, like 8-10min and eventually accumulate up to 45min of this work.  Start with something like 3x8min with either a full walk down recovery or if the hill is long enough you will get better effect from 2-3 min easy walking recovery between reps.

It sounds like you have a laid a great ME base but you need to turn this work into something a bit more specific to your goal event.

Good Luck

Scott

[xcevans]

Thanks Scott. Torbjorn is the same age as I am and raced against each other alot in the citizen races. I could keep up with him skating but classic skiing for Norwegians is natural for them. I jokingly say it’s in their dna and they learn to walk to get to their classic skis. The steep hill is an old 2 track road  that goes up for 3 miles with 2500′ total vertical. The old timers around here call it the goat trail. It starts with a 3/4 mile 1000′ pitch that has the 40% grades with short lower angle sections that takes me 24 min. I can extend the duration going up. Is the 2×24 min 48 min the total time you recomend for the heavy water carries. The moose hoof workouts make sense. Would you recomend doing thems as intervals only or do longer single length ones. I live in Midway Utah there are many trails around here that will work for for moose hoofs. For those who are not xc ski racers moose hoofs are long strides with intensity faster than walking but not running easy bounding simulating classic ski technique and can be done for longer periods of time than bounding.

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